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Divinity II - AP flying wing

Discussion in 'Single Wing Aircraft Plans' started by kram242, Nov 2, 2009.

  1. ewo

    ewo Moderator Staff Member

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    Hey that really looks great Flash It should sing right along. I am thinking about redesigning the fuse cover slightly and will definatly be adding a small foam strip to the bottom to aid in launching this little bugger .I think i will also make the little thin peices twords the tips a little wider because i can see thet theye could be easy to break untill theye are glued

    SO-------for the parts E being too short.Was it all the E parts? or just one? I aint shure why that happened. I have cut 3 so far and didnt have any problems.
     
  2. Flashsolutions

    Flashsolutions Active Member

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    Must be something about the way I arranged the parts or maybe my axis calibration, because 3 out of the 4 were short and 1 was right on the money.

    I haven't figured that one out yet. I have not checked my calibration since adding sand to the top roller. Then too, it could had been the bit I was using. I picked out one that was close but not the exact same as the material properties called for. I used a .044 that was handy. I have a lot of odd sizes from bits I bought at Skycraft. But one would have thought all 4 would have been the same.

    I am more curious about the CG on this guy. Looking at the original which called for 7 1/2 back from the tip and seeing where that comes out on the 24" version would have put the CG at 4", but when I balance it on a pencil or hand toss it for a quick flight check, it comes out at 4 1/2" meaning the battery has to go back further than the opening allowed.

    I cut out a bigger area for arranging the components. I have a lot of leeway now to adjust it wherever it needs to be but have not flown it as yet. Maybe tomorrow if the winds are light. Next indoor shot is Saturday.

    I think a sideways launch will work.... I imagine this little guy is going to be very hard to tell which side is up! I think I need to do some painting to distinguish top from bottom. But want to wait to see how it flys first.

    Can't wait to see how she handles.

     
  3. Anonymous

    Anonymous New Member

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    Flash, I did recalibrate the X-axis directly after adding more weight to the roller, and there was a 2 to 3 percent difference. How much was the difference in size, and was it in "X" and "Y", or just "X" ?
     
  4. Flashsolutions

    Flashsolutions Active Member

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    Found the cause... The last four pieces cut were the E parts and the bit apparently got hot and gummed up as it cutout the last three pieces.

    I wondered why 2 of them were broken. It all makes sense now.

    So anyway, I took the flying wing to the field this morning even though there are severe wind warnings for 10AM.

    I thought if I got there early enough I could beat the wind, but it was still pushing 12 mph according to my wind meter.

    I decided to try it any way. First maiden flight was in 12 gusting to 17 and it flew very well considering!

    I brought it in for a quick transmitter change to take out some of the throw on the surfaces and add more expo and the second flight was much easier yet still quite a handful given the windy conditions.

    The plane penetrated the wind quite well but as soon as I brought the nose up into high alpha, it was flying backwards quite rapidly.

    I decided to call it day before I ended up wrecking it.

    I then put my PBF in the air and nearly lost it. Talk about a handful!!! I really enjoy the challenge of trying to keep the PBF flying in the wind, but this wind was just too much for comfort so I brought it down and packed it in for the day.

    Can't wait to fly this baby indoors! I think it will be an excellent flyer.


     
  5. ApachePilot

    ApachePilot New Member

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    That's wonderful news...!!!!

    To hear that Divinity 24 has taken flight. I have questions but I am certain I would have to wait for calmer weather in order to have them answered. But here they go...........

    1. How would you describe 24's flight characteristics? Is it spirited?, fidgity? I know it can be quite nimble, but would you say it performed well.(ei) regardless the weather?

    2. You mention the possibility of flying indoors, does it slow down and float along? I am trying to find out at what her cruizing speed throttle setting would be....1/3-1/2 throttle to sail along?

    3. Did you end up leaving the cOg at 4.5" from the nose?

    4. You mentioned you used a 5 gram motor with 2cell setup; how was the glide? Long and flat or flat and steep?

    I am going to try a different route. I am going for a 3 gram motor, single cell setup to see if it can become a great backyard, indoor flyer.

    AP
     
  6. Flashsolutions

    Flashsolutions Active Member

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    Due to the windy conditions and short flights, I am in no position to judge its flight characteristics as yet with exception of maybe the CG.

    I believe the 4.5" CG point is accurate, otherwise, I might not have been able to fly it in those conditions.

    Heading into the wind, it flew straight and level with no ill effects. When I landed, I was just easing off on the throttle and it was staying perfectly level and gradually dropping altitude.

    I was flying at half to 2/3rds throttle in the wind, so I would say the 5g motor is going to be well suited for it.

    But again, I need some calmer conditions to really get a feel for how it will fly. Both flights I made were rather short, the first being an attempt to trim it out and I landed shortly after taking off because the wind was really wicked and the control surface throws were so extreme that any slight input for correction resulted in a lot of reaction to it. After regaining my composure and cutting the end points in half, I decided it had flown well enough to chance a second flight.

    The second flight was a little longer as I toyed with it. It was still very responsive with the reduced throws and was handling the wind remarkedly well given the severity of the gusting. When I brought the nose up, the wind caught it and carried it backward rather quickly leaving me over the parking lot and trees to either side.

    I got it back under control and started easing it back toward me and this time the wind was steady as I eased the throttle back and landed it softly in the grass next to my car.

    I decided 2 flights in those conditions was enough for one day.

    I will have to wait till Friday for my next opportunity. Saturday is indoors flying, but I hear the auditorium may not be available as there is a Christmas special that evening at the hall. Sunday is indoor flying at a second location, but it a much smaller area.



     
  7. Flashsolutions

    Flashsolutions Active Member

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    Storm has passed... it was dead calm outside so I could not resist flying in the lot next door.

    The flight without wind feeding it was a whole lot different.

    I think the CG needs to go back even further. I had to pull a lot of up elevator to keep her flying and there was quite a bit of porposeing going on although very shallow.

    Right turns seemed to be more difficult than left. In fact I was trying to turn right and it would not come about soon enough as I was headed towards the house, so I gave it full throttle and up elevator and cleared the house, still unable to bring it around. It was getting ready to head over the canal behind my home so I dropped it before letting it get into territory I didn't want it to be in.

    Suprisingly, no damage whatsover to the plane. It landed about 1 foot from the back of my screen porch. Another 20' and it would have been in the canal.

    I don't like flying around here because there are too many obstacles and too many places to get in trouble, but at least I was able to get a better feel for what needs to be done.

    I'm not sure I can get the weight moved back much further. I have the battery pretty far back as it is.

    Also not sure why I am having trouble turning right. Maybe I need to change the thrust angle a bit.

    Anyway, it flys pretty well and once I get it trimmed, I think it will be a lot of fun.
     
  8. ApachePilot

    ApachePilot New Member

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    Hmmmmm,

    Did you use the GWS 5043 Prop?, you may have too much prop on there causing torques issues. For your 5gram motor, might I suggest a lower pitch, ot size smaller prop.

    For the 5gram outrunners with around 2000KV, you might try these...


    Here are some measured data with various props.
    with 2S Lipo:
    GWS 3020 prop. 1 amp. ~38g thrust
    GWS 3030 prop 1.2 amps, ~44g thrust
    GWS 4025 prop 11,000 rpm, 1.4 amps, ~53gr thrust
    GWS 4530 prop 9,000 rpm, 1.6 amps, ~62 gr thrust
    GWS 4540 prop 1,9 amps, ~65g thrust
    GWS 5030 prop 8,950 rpm, 1,83 amps, ~76g thrust

    I hope you can get it figured out....

    As for the thrust-line... With all the Divinity wings this is set @ zero. No up/down and no side/side is needed or required. Divinty II should have zero reflex as well.

    1/2-2/3 throttle in the wind sounds right. Calm days should have your throttle around 1/4-1/3. DII's cOg was later moved to 7-3/4" from the nose as well.

    Thanks for your flight reports, I know we can get her flying smoothly...though I kinda knew it would be a handful at that size.Thank goodness for computer radios with expo and differential.

    AP
     
  9. ApachePilot

    ApachePilot New Member

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    DII-24" has maidened....!

    Last night I finished up electronic install on my DII-24" and took her outside.

    Details.

    Motor: E-Flite par-180 with GWS-3030 orange prop
    Batt: Lipo-2s ThunderPower 350mAh 7.4volt
    Esc: Feigao 6A brushless
    Rx: Blue-Bird 4 channel 72mHz FM
    Servos: Spektrum micros

    Not sure of the AUW yet, but I think it is around 3oz.

    Story:

    After charging the lipo and insuring that controls were set up in the right direction I gave DII a toss over a grassy area and was rewarded with a short flat glide,(all controls set to neutral). My second toss was at 1/2 throttle and she began to climb, my first turn was sharp and I had to stop her from spiraling in. I relaxed my grip on the controls and just feathered her around. I flew her for about 5 minutes around the parking lot at around 1/4-1/3 throttle and she would fly smoothly inside a 50' square. I landed her over top of a grassy area by cutting the throttle and letting her settle in. I am very happy, and have since reduce throws and added expo. I would say that 1/2" throw or less is all that is required for a wonderful time.

    Later today I hope to get a short video of her, weather permitting....

    AP
     
  10. ewo

    ewo Moderator Staff Member

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    Im so happy you have her going. I cant wait to get mine up. I tested my IPS system the other day to find i had a broken wire going into the motor. So i wont be using the brushless after all , I will be using brushed to start with and see how it goes. Probably will have a maiden this next weekend......It looks like im going to come in around 2.5 oz all up
    Just gotta find my esc for the brushed motor.
     
  11. Flashsolutions

    Flashsolutions Active Member

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    Tomorrow is looking good for another test flight for me. I don't have a 3" prop so I added magnet to the right wing tip where I can add a few as needed for countering the torque which I think was causing my right turn issue. We will see.

    Glad to see you have yours flying AppachePilot. ewo will soon make it 3.
     
  12. ewo

    ewo Moderator Staff Member

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    I was thinkin about that Flash. I was thinkin maby add a small strip of foam to the right aileron. :?: But then maby the little extra weight there will fix it .... I duno ! But do let us know. Mine will have a 3.5x 3 prop. i dont expect any torque issues
     
  13. ApachePilot

    ApachePilot New Member

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    With a 3-4" prop, you should have no issues with torque. I tried a 5"prop and seen some, but when I went to a 3.5 any torques issues disappeared.
    I would however like to say that elevator response needs to be tamed a bit....I think a 1/4 inch in each direction would be just fine.
    Now if I can just shave a few more grams...I might just attempt a sorte in our local elementary school gymnasium.

    AP
     
  14. Flashsolutions

    Flashsolutions Active Member

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    Got a chance to fly mine again today. Flew just great with only 1 magnet on the right tip. That seemed to counteract the torque just fine.

    It was porposing a lot! Moved the battery forward and it got better. Moved it again and it got better still. Probably could go just a tad more. I think it is sitting at 4.5" now which is where I first thought it should be. Maybe somewhere between 4.2 and 4.4 should do nicely.

    I was running out of time to try another setting but it should be a great little flyer if I can get the CG nailed down. I think the CG is pretty critical on these guys.
     
  15. ApachePilot

    ApachePilot New Member

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    Flash,

    That is wonderful news......

    I have been attempting to trim mine out as well, and have to agree that it will be a great lil flyer when properly setup. Wanting to get it in the air I ended up using heavier electronics that I really cared for,(came out at 3 ounces) but still have the lighter stuff being sent to me from HK.
    I can't wait for the day I can actually claim to be a member of the PhlatBoyz club. I should be able to place my order within the next month or so.

    Now I wonder if anyone else here has built the 48"version and flown it? Only time will tell, I guess.

    Let us know when you get her trimmed out...

    AP
     
  16. ewo

    ewo Moderator Staff Member

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    Never been a 48" for me. I dont do blue. ;)

    But my 24" looks very promising. Still have to hook up the elevon pushrods but all in all its not too bad at just a tic over 56 grams at this point...... battery is 9 grams with wires..and its 3 cell

    wires on the esc have been cut down a lot .... Gws ips and 3.3 black right now, im shure it will fly fine when the wind and rain subsides ........... 20 more minuts to finish then we will see ! Batteries all charged and ready to go ! :) Attached files [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  17. ewo

    ewo Moderator Staff Member

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    Ok i got my maidens done ! First flight was interesting to say the least, I had 2 encounter's with trees and one with the telephone pole stationed in the center of my back yard. CG was a little far back but the plane really did handel quite nicely at 1/2 and less throttle... The head on encounter with the pole was nothing to worry about . it didnt even leave a dent. ;)
    And it was easy enough to retrieve the plane frome the second tree as the thing was way down low.... Here is a verry short video of the second flight attemts with many problems going on at the same time. Its windy , BAD BAD radio TX problems then when the rain started that was it for me . Video is here

    AP has at least 2 videos of his plane but no post with the video links here ?????
    I really wish we were all on the same page here.....

    Anyways as always just have fun and remember to put the hot glue away on these little ones ... You just dont need it.... AT ALL !

    ewo
     
  18. ApachePilot

    ApachePilot New Member

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    I see what you mean bruce about the radio issues. I hope you get it fixed soon. All in all, not a bad performance. Looks like the 5 gram motor is just what Divinity 24 needs. THat video is with a 3 cell lipo? Sounds like a lil screamer.

    My first video is a short one taken at night under non ideal conditions, but here we have it.
    [vimeo]http://www.vimeo.com/8046374[/vimeo]

    My next video was taken the following day again not under ideal conditions or location, but I was able to show that 24 does indeed fly and will perform well, if kept light.
    [vimeo]http://www.vimeo.com/8066232[/vimeo]

    AP
     
  19. ToxicToast

    ToxicToast Down in the weeds. Staff Member

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    That is seriously cute EWO. Very impressive little bugger!
     
  20. cncmachineguy

    cncmachineguy Member

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    I took my finally finished D2 out for her madien today, after playing with the COG, she flew very nice. I found the COG to be 9.25 inches back from the front point. Quite a difference from the posted 7.5 to 7.75. I am not sure whats up but she flew nice.

    She never would loop though, full up would send her into an instant 90 vertical and there she sat. Hmmm
     
  21. cncmachineguy

    cncmachineguy Member

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    I have been doing some reading over at RCG about the d2. I may have found the cog issue, AP's posted plans are for a 42". File posted here cut a 48". So it stands to reason the cog needs to move back. Also seems to make sense if the 24"ers are at 4.5, 48 would be at 9ish.

    IDK just trying to get what should be an awesome wing to fly as it should.
    :?
     
  22. mudman1959

    mudman1959 Member

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    Hey Guys... Just started this one to replace a FFF 48" wing that was having issues... Looks like this one will be a good flier! I had Navionflyer cut it out for me on his Phlatprinter. I added carbon fiber rods to the plane, I put them down each side of the leading edges about a 1/2" back from it and also added one just behind the battery/receiver box. I also stripped the the plastic sheeting off of the foam where the wing panels will be glued together so that there is no chance of it separating once it is glued together. The servos are mounted from the bottom for a lower profile to keep the top cleaner. I should have a chance today to start getting it glued together... I still need to look at the motor mount and see if I want to use a flat mount just glued on or a stick mount. Using a stick mount, I will have to run the motor wires through a new wire run since the stick mount will go where there pre-cut one is now. Thanks to Apache Pilot for the Design and Kram242 for redesigning it for the Phlatprinter... And of course Navionflyer for cutting it out for me.... Mudman1959
     
  23. kram242

    kram242 Administrator Staff Member

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    Sounds awesome mudman,
    I built one but never got the chance to fly it and all my gear was being used elsewhere :(
    Looking forward to your maiden flight!
    Mark and Trish
     
  24. mudman1959

    mudman1959 Member

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  25. navionflyer

    navionflyer New Member

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    Mudman showed it to me at work yesterday. It's looking good. I am looking forward to a first flight report. This one is on my short list as well.

    Tim
     

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